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We’re going to talk about Fusaka…ohhhhh yeah!
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It’s a Bitcoin contest. The only one that’s making your money you listen to the Bitcoin market. So hold on. Listen to the Bitcoin. >> Hey everybody, welcome back to the Bitcoin podcast on this beautiful Friday afternoon on the east coast of the United States of America. >> Holler, >> I’m the host that talks first. My name is Dmitri. >> And I am host number two, Dr. Corey Petty. >> I wonder how many people didn’t know my name was Dmitri. They always say it’s like Demetrius or like Dimmitri or I’ve heard so many variations of your name. So, >> lots of variations. Lots of variations. The one I’ve been getting a lot lately is Demetrix. >> So, that particular person whenever they say it, I look around for other Demetri. And they’re always like, “Why are you looking around?” And I’m like, “I was just looking for other >> other me.” >> And she’s like, “What are you? What are you?” And I’m like, >> “Ah, how do you adding just adding letters?” No, no. Just regular old uh Caucasian American from Southern America. >> All right. >> Here’s one thing, Cory. I got to hold you to tax on this. Do the part that you’re the only white person on this show. >> That’s fine. >> Y’all got to learn and stop up foreign people’s names because it is disrespectful. >> I mean, >> no, I mean just learn the name. Just just learn it. when you start when you start pronouncing pronunciating Asian people names correctly, then I’ll then I’ll I’ll I’ll let that slide because this isn’t a one person this isn’t a one race thing here. >> I know a lot of Asian people and I pronounce their names correctly. >> Get the out of here. >> I know a lot of Asian people and I pronounce it. There’s a guy at work right now. His name is Fan. I said, “Is that Fawn?” He said, “No, it’s Fan.” And I said, “Okay, I’m gonna call you Fan.” >> All right. You representative. >> Sorry, this got off. This got off on a tangent really fast. I hope you’ve been well, Corey. I’ve been well. >> I’ve been good. I’ve been great. >> We got Ken and the Hezy in the back on the ones and twos. Ken, give them a shout. Do your thing. >> You’ll drop >> Yo, what’s up, guys? Hope everybody’s doing well today. >> I love it. I love it. I love the like hovering voice like you’re just there. >> Just there, man. >> He’s around, >> man. Man behind the mirror. Um, so today what we wanted to talk about which is is rather important to the the crypto community at whole is the Fusaka upgrade. >> Fusaka. >> Now Fusaka is not a like it’s not a video game or anything. I’m pretty sure don’t they name the upgrade from where they the events were? >> Yeah. >> of Fulu and Osaka. H. So what Faka did in a nut in a nut large I don’t know what the what Faka did in a nut shell bigger blob capacity. Um which means and it’s cheap not that doesn’t mean that but they also made it cheaper for L2s to settle onto the old L1 and some lighter node ops. I don’t know if they mean ops codes or just ops. >> Op codes difference. >> Not ops codes. Ops. Op codes. >> Ops. Ops. >> So, it’s an infra upgrade, right? It’s like a I think they’re trying to make it cheaper uh to settle on Ethereum so that it can more efficient for L2s to post data. Um, teardas is a big one which slices up the amount of um things that validators need to actually validate which drastically lowers computational bandwidth costs for them and decongests the network in a lot of ways so that like the requirements of running a validator are less which is really great. I always push for those types of things because the lower you can bring down the requirements for an individual validator, the more likely you can get home runners, people who can run things things at home and like less institutional players. And this is always a really good signal for decentralization, which is important. >> Home runners, >> I run validators. I think they’re important. >> I don’t have any validators. I wish I did, but I’m not a baller like that. A real gangster. Um, yeah, I don’t organization I work for run like creates Nimbus, one of the clients that runs Ethereum. And so I, you know, as a good employee and someone who cares about this stuff, I test their software. I run it. I make sure things are going well. There are bugs, I report them. Hey man, I ain’t mad at you. It’s a nice benefit package. Tell you that much. Hey, here’s some Ethereum nodes as a benefits package. >> Yeah, >> it’s not a bad gig. You know, it there’s worse >> there’s worse benefits. I I had to guess. >> So, I don’t know. To me, it just kind of feels like um they’re trying to they want to compete with Salana. I don’t I don’t know how this can make it easier for home nodes when the blob capacity is larger which means more data storage which means I need bigger terabytes I need hexabytes >> yeah it’s a it’s a gab so with blob storage um >> that doesn’t stick around forever those are those are temporary stoages right um we don’t hold on to blob the L2 blobs for longer than they need to be there such that the L2 secure their transactions for a given amount of time and then they’re not then they’re let go of. So that that section of storage is differentiated than like what you would normally consider the ledger that holds on to everything in the audit trail forever. Um, and that’s a recent change in a lot of these blockchain networks and that they’re starting to realize that not everything needs to live forever, especially when the point of the base chain is for settlement purposes and validation of a larger set of coordinators. And so what you’re seeing is the base chain being a meta layer which doesn’t need to hold on to everything. It just needs to make sure that the settlement can happen appropriately for the user. And the layer twos can do whatever they want and they settle to make sure that arbitration or like uh what’s the word I’m looking for? I guess arbitration can happen so that if if a conflict happens they can exit in time all these types of things and so it only needs to be valid for that amount of time which is subjective I’d say but like that allows layer 2s to experiment do other things specialize things like this and then leverage the chain appropriately but the chain doesn’t get bogged down as the number of layer twos scale over time >> could level twos could layer twos also have blobs Could there be nested blobs? >> Yeah, 100%. I mean, you can have layer. There’s already layer threes. >> Blob blob. Three blobs. >> Blob blob blob blah blah blah. Sorry, we had a question come through. I just want to answer your question. Smashable. Sorry, that’s not what that says. That says >> it could be >> XMSable. It’s like textable. >> Anyways, yeah, we’re talking about the Fusaka upgrade on Ethereum network. If you’re unfamiliar with Ethereum, um I don’t even know how you found this podcast. Got to be honest with you, Ethereum is a type of cryptocurrency. It’s blockchain network. All the above. So, I don’t know. I to me it feels like I said, it feels like a like an upgrade to kind of get ahead of the lunch that was getting eaten by Salana to, you know, make it a little bit cheaper, you know, for the L2s to to to settle so they can do more things for less. Right. More for less. Sunday, Sunday, Sunday. >> And I had heard rumors, suspicions from folks that like like you’ve seen the narrative of Ethereum change quite rapidly um over the past couple months towards privacy and trying to like, okay, cool. we’ve quote unquote settled enough of the scaling problem that we need to start thinking about privacy and introducing making sure privacy is a stronger part of of how we how how things are built and we can talk all about how that can happen but um it seems as though there’s a set of people within the foundation maybe that are more concerned with what you’re talking about like competing with the likes of Salana because Salana is >> um quote unquote built to scale and it’s fast and cheap and operates in a very different way that uh tracks some of the users like you know memecoins and is always always on that. >> Yeah. >> So there’s this uh I don’t know is like is there a zero sum game here where like there’s only so many users and each network is vying for their attention. >> I mean yes and no. Uh, I mean it’s it’s hard when I look at crypto as a whole these days. I’m seeing how it’s not too far removed from where it started about 10 years ago. Yeah, there’s a hell of a lot more money in it, but when you get new people coming into crypto, they’re still getting in it for that one reason. If you if you want to make things easy for people, they’ll be easier to get in. But the first thing they’re going to do is they just want to kind of Everybody wants to try to get a bag like that that that’s that’s 99% of people like there’s your 1% of people. >> Well, that’s how it’s sold, right? Like I mean like getting into crypto is still sold as like buy an asset, buy something and then and then stare at >> you just reminded me of the garbage that we faced earlier this this afternoon. So like quick story audience. Uh Corey and I have a friend. That friend does a professional job. She said, “Hey, you know, one of my clients sent me this video of this guy talking about crypto. Is this guy legitimate?” And we listen to this guy who basically looks like um I don’t know, grown baby man. Like he’s got lots of hair and he’s like talking about XRP being a deflationary asset. But I made the mistake of swiping up, which and then the algorithms were like, “Oh, you like this crypto shit?” So, they sent me other crypto shows of the of of like people doing the exact same thing. It’s just a public service announcement to you all out there. If you’re new and you’re getting into crypto, um, just listen to our show, right? We’re not we’re just listen to us. All right? We’re not those dudes. We’re not we’re not going to point you. >> I’m not going to sell you anything. >> We’re not selling you We’re just trying to slowly, you know, uh, raise your acumen, your cryptocurrency acumen. Uh, so you understand what’s going on when you read the articles, but we’re not going to sit here and try and tell you that XRP is going to go to 2500 and XRP because of >> stupid video she sent me. >> Yeah, >> I really like I’ve I’ve XRP is this thing that been stuck around where I’m just like why are people still talking about this? What is what have they done to stick in other than like lobby like heavy lobby? But like they’re getting like influencers to talk about them as if there’s something special. >> Are they are they paying for influencers? >> They pay cost like that ain’t cheap. I mean they’re lobbying so of course but like >> of course it’s not cheap but it’s very easy to do man. >> It’s like hey influencer talk about XRP in this way shape or form. >> Yeah I mean there’s an easy recipe to success. Do you find a attractive woman or man? >> That dude was not attractive. >> He was attractive to some ladies. I guarantee ladies like that, >> I guess. >> Right. And then you pay them a big bag of money, right? And you say, “Hey, talk about my thing.” That’s never changed. That’s been a thing since like ever. That’s that’s like >> recipe for success. >> I mean, unless I’m wrong, Ken, you got a little bit of acumen in marketing. I mean, isn’t that a good recipe? I mean, it works, right? Alls I’m going to say is Amway still exists today. So um there’s a lot of what are those things like schemes that are quite sustainable and have been around for 20 30 years you know so I would just uh I would tread cautiously by like kind of aligning with um oh well they’ve been here for a while you know I’m pretty sure there’s some legitimacy going on there because I think XRP is full of still at the end of the day. >> Yeah. I think I’m going to do a deep dive. I’m going to do like a like a historical view of like how XRP has stayed relevant. >> And my my inclination my my hypothesis here is that uh none of it has to do with anything technical whatsoever. >> No single bit. It’s you know what I think you know in a high level overview it is it’s the marketability the um market making of it as far as >> they definitely like buddied up to banks right and like very close to traditional banking system traditional finance >> like they they tried to work with regulation they got past their their um getting sued or whatever it was that go through the courts so they by not >> I don’t know how they got past it but they got past it and so like all of these things led to them saying like, “Hey guys, we’re legitimate. We’re still here. We got a bunch of money.” And that alone has some level of marketability, but there’s no reason for it. That’s differentiated from anything that anyone would care about. >> Yeah. >> Play devil’s advocate a little bit here. Well, sorry. Go ahead. Um, >> no, no, no. Go do that. So Ethereum brings everything from a technological standpoint as far as like the ideal blockchain in a sense, right? As far as like to date to date, like of course Bitcoin has done great, you know, but as far as like where we stand today over the last 10 years, Ethereum’s kind of solidified itself as like, okay, if I want to like be on like that bleeding edge, start working on something really cool and scaling in the space. I mean you see like Visa with all their PC’s and kind of like a lot of other institutions like kind of dabbling more and more into Ethereum right so outside of the technological aspect of things do you think XRP did everything right from the left curve of everything >> as far as like the marketing >> theility what’s what’s the point what’s the point of blockchain >> yeah yeah I think that that kind of dives back into that >> it depends right depends on your view there if it’s to make banks better they’ve done a lot of things Right. >> Yeah. >> Um I don’t think that’s why this stuff is useful. Uh because they’re just going to make banks better and all the ways that we don’t like banks. >> Mhm. >> Uh while saying all the words that a lot of us like. >> Yeah. >> Um so I don’t know about that one. That one’s hard for me to that’s that one’s hard for me because like they have been successful in making themselves relevant and buddying up to people to continue to make themselves relevant but not to any of our benefit. Like do you think the >> do you think the pendulum ever switches back where you know banks started out as the good guys and now they’re clearly the bad guys? Like there’s no way around them being the bad guys. >> They were convenience, right? Early banks were just a convenience. >> It wasn’t just convenience. It was like they were literally saving your wealth from the church. Like literally like with them I want to carry on a bunch of gold. >> Not with guns but with swords. With swords and security securing your wealth from the church which was going to come in and take it. That’s the history in a very short snippet. So for the people listening, go Google that. But now they’re the bad guys. Clearly they’re like, “Hey, give me your money. I’m going to go make money off of your money and I’ll pay you back 0.1% and I’m gonna keep the rest >> and I’m gonna keep I’m gonna keep the rest and then if you want to try it all come get it back at once. Uh, no. The answer is no. You cannot have your money, right? So, they’re definitely the bad guys now. >> But when you said something interesting, you said make the banks better. Crypto can make the banks better. And I’m like, does the pendulum ever swing where banks become like a good thing now? I mean, >> yeah, they’re going to do things that like they can already do things now with this technology that would make them so much better, like legitimately better for society. They’re not doing any of those things. We talked we talked with um um Benet Dan Benet. Who was >> Bon ago? What? >> Bonet. >> Yeah. Dan Benet, a cryptographer world eh >> eh bh. >> And he had discussed with us in that in that show this idea of like proving the like your your balance. You could have banks that prove that they own all of the things they say they own so that you can do audits regularly and that everyone has strong confidence, cryptographically strong confidence that their money is in the thing they are using, the custodianship that they’re using. They don’t do that. Why don’t you do that? Because they don’t they can’t do that. They don’t want to do that. >> But they also don’t want people knowing what they own. >> That’s what I’m talking about. Like they don’t do it because they don’t want to. So, like we could make makes better now. We could build a new bank that’s better, but why would you when you can just keep taking advantage of people? See, but then that perpetuates, right? Because now we’ve got like we started the show talking about Ethereum. Ethereum is going to you said that they’re moving into privacy. There’s this privacy wave. I think it was sparked by the fact that Zcash is just exploding in value, right? And so, um, now Ethereum is going to start flirting with privacy again, right? So what’s to keep the these entities from doing the same exact thing if just the rails are no longer an antiquated banking system and the rails are now Ethereum and then they have these things you know they turn on privacy or whatnot and they’re going to do the same thing. They’re going to be like oh you can’t audit us because we have like 50% of our transactions. >> Yeah. But the way in which we’re doing privacy well here’s we can make the same argument right. So what you can do with privacy is and there’s an interesting thing here right? It’s like where is the privacy being guaranteed? Um, privacy just means that I know that when I communicate with somebody, the only person that has the information that I’m communicating is the person I’m communicating with and no one else along the lines. So, when you’re thinking about digitally, that means that no one else gets to know the message I send you in any way, shape, or form. Actually, no one gets to know that I sent you a message. Only you do, right? And so what what we have there is a strong confidence that you only have the information that I’ve sent you and nothing more. Even the process of sending you that information doesn’t link more information about me to anyone including you other than what I wanted you to get. That’s privacy. That’s the idea of privacy. What we can do there is >> selectively disclose at any point that information to other people. So, I have no guarantees that you don’t take that information that I’ve given you and disclose it. I can’t have that guarantee. And so, privacy just gives you the ability to do selective disclosure. And you can be as compliant as you want to in that environment, but you have to opt into it. And so, that means consent. You’re just giving people the consent, the ability to give consent when doing disclosure of the information that they care about. That’s it. That’s the only thing you’re adding. >> So, what how does that not end up if you take it out to the longtail? I love that. We should do a segment. Like whenever I say longtail, like something pops up. Um, all you’re going to have is like a small percentage of people that know how to shield their transactions and things like that and a large percentage of the population that knows how to but doesn’t care and won’t do it. And then there’s going to be another percentage that’s like, I don’t even know how to do that. I just need to use it, >> right? >> Yeah, you can make that. You can make it usable. >> How does the power dynamic shift? Like it’s going to go to the people that know how to use the the privacy, right? That’s where the power goes. >> So that’s so like you’re giving people options on how and when they disclose various pieces of information about themselves and who they’re communicating with. Um and over time because optionality is hard, people don’t know the right decision to make. You end up with aggregating resources that choose some of those options for you and that’s like a centralizing factor, right? This that’s like Coinbase m, you know, makes it easy for you to get crypto, right? And they’re they’re a centralized entity on top of a decentralized infrastructure. >> Yeah. But you still have the ability to remove your coins in the event you don’t like what they’ve done, which puts the onus on them to still provide good services. Whenever you have the ability to exit, when you can actually exit and keep the things with you, it forces the entity that’s providing you a service to provide good service and not take advantage of you. And that’s the important part. So there’s always going to be centralizing because like you’re right, most people don’t care. I just want to like click a button and have the things and not give away the responsibility. But for like yeah those that grow >> and learn that they do want that responsibility, they need avenues to to exit and and take that or for those of us that actually do care, we need options. The I would say the adoption curve is getting rather steep. I don’t think there’s a single person on the planet who doesn’t know what cryptocurrency is at this point. or or like they may they’ve at least heard of it, right? No, I’d say like knows what it is. Like I was eating dinner just last night. >> They all know >> talking with the owner of this restaurant and let them know kind of like what my side business is >> and he’s like, “Oo, cryptocurrency.” Yeah. But for the first time, he didn’t go like like XRP. And I was like I was happy. I was like, “Yes, this can bring up XRP. >> He at least knows what’s going on.” Um but so so like everybody knows about it, right? But it’s kind of like one of those things where um I just don’t think it’s going to have necessarily a large impact in the long I don’t even know how to measure that impact. >> Well, that’s the thing, right? Like if we can make things in such a way where the infrastructure is better but the end result of people’s use their everyday experience doesn’t they don’t know they’re using blockchain cryptocurrency whatever but the service that’s being provided to them is better because of it. Is that still good? Uh, I don’t know if it’s good enough because to me it wasn’t it’s not tough to learn Bitcoin. If we start with Bitcoin, it was rather easy after I got past the white paper and you’re like, “Hey, just download this wallet.” And I downloaded the wallet and I had it and I was like, “Oh, okay, cool. I got some Bitcoin.” And then it was easy. It was like, “Oh, here’s the to address and here’s the from address. That’s just like a bank account.” Like that’s not not it’s not difficult. There’s nothing difficult there. The math isn’t difficult. None of those things are difficult, right? It’s the human as it’s become more adopted, the human humans like to inject the complexity into it. And that’s that’s where it’s like frustrating. It’s like it’s not that difficult, right? Like whenever I I I’ve broken down Ethereum transactions to people who were like one day new to crypto and they’re like, “Oh, it’s not that it’s not that difficult at all. It’s actually kind of neat.” And I was like, “Yeah, it’s not it’s not tiring. You just get to see it. >> Yeah, >> you get to see if you want. You can look at the pipes whereas like traditionally speaking, >> try sending a wire via um what is it called? >> The wire. >> No. Uh what is that yellow company called? >> Western. Oh yeah, >> yeah, Western Union. Try sending a wire through them and then tracking it. Good luck. >> Can you ever use Western Union? I’ve used it one time in my >> several times and it is always going to the abyss. Like you have no idea. >> Like >> it’s just like I hope I get a call in like 48 hours that everything went through. >> Well, that person got it. I don’t know what to do if they don’t. >> If they don’t get their money, you’re just like, >> I don’t know what to tell you. >> That way. And it was so bad. It was so bad. Like she’d call me like 12 hours later like, “Hey, I got your thing.” And I was like, “Oh, cool. Thanks. I’m trying to go to sleep.” Granted, that that being said, like I’ve had some we’ve had some serious butt puckering moments in crypto too, right? We’re like, >> “Oh my god, >> I’ve sent I’ve sent a lot of money for various reasons to somebody or myself and like for one reason or another like the RPC broke or I don’t know, I lost it, something happened and like I look and like it’s not there. >> It’s gone.” >> And I’m like, >> you know what I hated was when you said >> we got things to improve on our side. >> Yeah. Like when you said multiple transactions on the hot wallet like three, four years ago and it would just like disappear and then reappear and then disappear. It’s just like oh my god this is so bad. >> We even been we we’ve been through it gentlemen. We’ve earned our stripes. >> I’ve even I’ve even sent money into the void where it didn’t show up. >> Yeah. Same. >> I had a lot of like back in the day, right? Like if you if like for those who are listening, there’s a few of you here or who are listening later. If you were, any of you were OG enough to ever use the like original shape shift that didn’t have the structure that it has today, you were sending money into a void and it you hoped it came by the other side. There was no way to track it. You have no idea where it went, how it got back there, but it got there like for me every time. But uh we was that was that nice couple nice couple minutes of just like hoping I just lose all my money. >> I thought I lost a six figure transaction on the Avalanche network and that day I I like looked >> Oh, with an XMP chain. >> Yeah, cuz I was trying to transfer chain to chain and I didn’t approve both sets of transactions, just the initial one. >> And I kept like hitting refresh. Oh my god, dude. I was like I feel like >> I think we gota we gota figure this out. my body like my soul left my body and was looking at me like this is not a good situation you’ve put yourself in and I was like oh no but that’s that’s you know those are the things that hopefully over time it gets easier for the the everyday person to use crypto um the thing that I see you know you’re old enough to kind of like see the writing on the walls that you know the the wealthy people now know like oh you know this is the yellow brick road crypto I’m going to go ahead and gobble this all up all of it. And then when hits the fan, society’s going to need it. And now I get to take fractions of a penny of every time they use this thing. And that’s just like, you know, you see it happening. You saw there was some news just today I was reading where the the old Trump family has a has the number eight Bitcoin treasury now out of the blue. >> I that that that requires some verification. I’m not sure about that one. Well, obviously with them they lie when they breathe, but it’s just, you know, it’s like the time for the normal everyday person to stack crypto to a point where they would be inoculated to some of the that goes on is passed. I feel like that time has passed. >> This is not new. Um, I I’ll go a diet tribe here. Um, >> ooh, a diet tribe. You say >> I got into this this whole thing because I call it it’s like it’s like proitizing and pushing for what I call resistant technology, right? It is technology that keeps the from taking over. And so when you’re talking about situations in which people can say, I’ll just accumulate it all. It’s all mine now. That is not resistant to Now it’s better than it used to be. Like the whole mining structure of Bitcoin, the fairness of various proof ofstake protocols. Uh the transparency of who has what. These things are like pushing in the right direction, but they’re not quite resistant. And like even if you look back at the early ICOs of Ethereum, um I did a number of distribution analyses. If you go look at like all my old blogs on ICO distributions, you can see that the narrative at the time was, oh my god, we’re being so fair. We’re like really enabling anyone to have, you know, to like contribute to um fundraising and have a, you know, equal share and all these different projects that we’re enabling and all this great stuff. And and to be fair, they were lowering the barrier of entry. there’s a significant amount of entries into these things and access to these things that people never had before. So people were contributing to these projects in the thousands. Then you look at the distribution of contribution and and then which was like heavily skewed towards a few people owning the lion share of all of it and then a real long tale of a lot of small holders. Nothing’s really changed there, right? Having a distribution like that means that it’s still influenced by small amounts of people and the rest of it’s just along for the ride. And that’s the way it feels like today in traditional systems is like, yeah, I can get some stocks. Yeah, I can hold some cash. I can do stuff, but there’s no real ownership in that. Just I’m just along for the ride for the from the big players. >> And like these systems in my opinion are an attempt to meter that as much as possible. such that you don’t end up in a situation where it’s just a few people controlling everything and a bunch of people who have exposure that are along for the ride. And we’re not there yet. We’re just not there yet. >> No, we’re not. I don’t think I think we’ll be there for some time. But what I do know where we are is Bitcoin is sitting at $90,000. So that’s pretty cool. >> And it’s a good ride. I mean, don’t get me wrong, it’s been a great ride. >> That’s true. Like I haven’t I haven’t invested much in crypto. I’ve been in it for 12 years now or whatever it’s been. But like the amount of money that I’ve put into it has been pretty minimal. >> I’ve just earned a lot of it. Like I I work for projects, get paid and stuff, right? I’ve done a lot of that, which has been a really great ride, but it’s still not influential enough. What are you doing in the background here? What is this crap? >> I made a background. It’s a bank boxing a regular. >> Oh, you’re doing the generated background. Someone can see that I mean I don’t know how to get it so that >> you can do overlay behind generating backgrounds of this. >> Yeah, >> that’s if you look at the the uh the mobile version of this like the chat is on top of her head. Take the chat out. >> Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. My bad. Let me let me get get that out of there. Yeah, that’s what we’re up against. Why? Why would AI choose to make the thing punching the screen? >> I don’t know. >> Why was that the decision it made? >> Oh, wow. Yeah, it’s breaking the screen. >> So silly. Anyways, we’ll go back to regular here. Let me get that. >> His gloves are huge. >> All right, let’s get those little baby hands. >> There we go. Um, so getting if we’re going full circle, um, Ethereum continues to upgrade. I I still think that one of the greatest achievements of Ethereum is how it uh hard forks so easily. Or is this a hard fork? This is a hard fork. Stock is a hard fork. And so they built hard forks into the progression path. Um >> well that’s a but they didn’t build it in that’s a human thing. >> Yeah. Yeah. I’m saying like like the plan upgrade the upgrade strategy like socially speaking >> is Yes. through hard forks. >> But that’s much different than Bitcoin, right? much different because even even Satoshi himself or herself or themselves or itself said once Bitcoin hard forks it’s a wrap like he was like that’s it like Bitcoin hard fork is the the beginning of the end. >> Yeah, but we went through hard forks. You like >> Yeah, but I mean Bitcoin has Bitcoin has been a tough >> Bitcoin hard forks on purpose. Segregated witness was a planned >> upgrade. That wasn’t a hard fork. That was soft fork. H they did end up implementing as a soft fork, didn’t they? >> Yeah, that’s soft fork. >> But the hard fork was the Bitcoin Cash thing >> and that was >> that was a fork. That was just a fork. That’s different, right? There’s a there’s a there is there let’s let’s get to the bottom of this. Um >> it was a hard fork. >> Yeah. But Bitcoin Cash. Yeah, Bitcoin Cash >> that’s called. So, yes, that was a that was a um not a socially accepted hard fork. That was a that was a a separation of the community. And so, >> yes, >> when dealing with blockchain networks, uh >> I’ll get to that in a second, Ken. Uh when dealing with blockchain networks, >> wait, >> you have a you have a set of rules that you’re validating as you’re running a validator. There are a set of rules that makes a transaction valid and how you change those rules dictates whether or not you have a hard or soft fork. So if you have a further constraining of the rules, meaning that you’ve added a new rule that is just a a a further constraining, then you can do a soft fork, right? >> Because then you can just change the rules and old things are still valid subject to the new constraint. If you add a new rule that is an expansion of those rules, then you have to do a hard fork because an old valid transaction can never view a new transaction that’s valid as valid. There’s no way to do it. >> So those are the difference between a hard and soft fork technically speaking. And then you have the social acceptance of these forks. So when you do a hard fork and you change the rules in such a way where it’s an expansion of the rule set uh and the community doesn’t agree with it, you end up with two separate chains completely. And that’s what happened, right? And so that’s a different type of thing because you have a you have a splitting of the community in the process of doing that where you end up with a a clone of the same assets that then have two new futures based on the two different sets of rules that are agreeing are quote unquote valid. And that’s when you had a lot of the separations of all the different Bitcoin versions and flavors. Bitcoin Cash being the most popular of those. Um Ethereum Classic was an example of this. um when you had the uh the hard fork that dealt with the Dow hack same class didn’t like that. >> Mhm. So, and they also ended up staying with proof of work during the beacon chain migration. But like so that’s a separation of uh consensus of social rules like what the community thinks should happen which is a very different thing and the most important thing that there is. And so Ethereum is is is really interesting in that for the majority for like the vast majority of the community throughout its history they’ve agreed that this is the way we do upgrades. We make hard forks which are pretty drastic changes in the rules and everyone follows it. They’re almost seamless. Almost every single one of them we’ve done has been seamless. The transition proof of work, a proof of stake >> and the and and how smooth that went >> is probably one of the greatest engineering feats of humankind. >> Like without >> that’s the most impressive thing about Ethereum in my opinion right now other than the price. If the price gets to 17K like I’ve been predicting that would be dope. I would love that. >> Be super dope. I’d love that. >> I would a few homes got some >> happy about that targeting right now workshop. That’s for sure. >> Oh, and for those who are in the in the Discord, I know I said nine months, but it might be like nine days. >> You know, you I say you held true to the petty index. We can include we can include you into the Petty Ferguson house index. >> Yeah. >> When we buy houses, the price goes down significantly. So, I’ve huddle plus, but my plus sign is real estate. And so, you guys, I’m sorry. If there is a house index for us, it’s going to be getting dinged quite a bit. I might be getting another one here in like 10 days. So, um, sorry. I know I said nine months like a week ago, but things change, you know. You just got to be ready for change. >> Sell time to sell it all. Ding, ding, ding, ding. >> Sell all your crypto. >> Yeah. Hashnot financial advice, but I’m probably going to buy another house like so. Uh, that’s for you, Joe. >> Um, >> yeah, >> Ken asked me in our chat whether or not I ever did get to spar with Roger Ver. And no, I have not. >> I’d love to, though. That’d be really fun now that he’s out of jail. Actually, you know what? It might be worse that he’s out of jail. >> He might be in shape. >> I’ve learned learned some things in prison. >> He’s probably gonna be like, >> Bitcoin Cash >> about tattoos. Yeah, he’s gonna have like Bitcoin cash at it. What’s up, Ken? >> I brought I brought it up because I remember the last time you interviewed him, you guys were supposed to link up and get that going. So, >> guess he’s way better than me. Like, he’s way way way better than me. Kicked the out of me. But, >> it’s still like jiu-jitsu is is one of those things where everyone spars with everyone and everyone learns. It’s great. >> I think you could beat him if you watched Blood Sport before you did. >> Can’t beat him. I I would be I would be happy if I caught him in anything without him. Just watch Blood Sport and get get motivated. >> All right. I do that anyway every week. So like we’ll see how well it works. >> You watch Blood Sport every week. Is that >> every week? Every every Monday. That’s how I start my weeks. Watch Blood Sport. >> Does Does your wife come into the living room with you doing repeat roundhouse kicks? >> Yep. >> Kumate. Kumate. That’s You got to do that thing. That’s they were doing. That’s what the audience does. Yeah. >> Um, anyways, uh, so I mean, we’ve been going for a little while here. 40 minutes. >> We can wrap it up. Um, >> you got anything else? You want you want to add anything else? >> No. Yeah. I think, uh, next month or in the next couple months, I think it’d be really cool for you to like assess the Dow hack 10 years later, like how it’s affected Dows like as far as like the trajectory, you know, like a general fork interest and how forks are dealt with today. And, >> you know, people still haven’t tried to redo the Dow. It was a really good idea. I’ve yet to see a resurgence in the attempt again. >> Um, >> the only problem with the Dow is that it had a hack in it that we didn’t know existed because solidity was new and we didn’t understand how >> um you can have re-entry attacks in the bite code and we didn’t have a security industry to audit things. We didn’t have all that stuff. So, >> yeah, >> surprised it hasn’t been redone yet that I’m aware of. >> Dude, I just thought of a really cool idea. I want to talk about when we turn the lights off here in a second. Anyways, um I would love to go back to the Dow. I was such a believer in the Dow. I tried to get >> You put a lot of money in the Dow. >> I had to, >> but you got it back. >> I got it back. I got it back. It’s fine. >> You got double back. That was the crazy part. >> I didn’t get double back. >> Yeah, it forked and you got Ethereum Classic. >> Yeah, I sold that You’re right. Uh >> you got double back. I was like, “Oh more money.” And I got rid of that Ethereum Classic immediately instantaneously. >> But anyways, uh hey, uh so guys, thanks for listening in. I’ve seen that like 30 people come in and out, which is kind of a new thing for us. We haven’t really >> I guess we hit a couple waves of like, you know, pushing us out there into the into the ethers. >> I really think it’s the kids that just got home from school and they have unt Oh no. >> Oh. Oh, big words. I’m out. I need to see dancing. I need to see dancing. Uh but anyways, uh >> you’re not moving the camera enough. I can’t watch this. >> Thanks to you guys for did listen and we had some comments. don’t really get them, but whatever. You guys can um always like if if you actually like the show, you can call in when we’re live. By call, we mean just like ask to get on and we’ll give you the link and you can get >> on to the show with us. >> Lucky. >> Yeah. That’s dangerous territory though. When Jesse did it last two weeks ago, I was like >> worked out all right. >> Yeah. So, you know, Jesse, when you TC see this, which you might or might not, those people are screened before they just answer the phone call in those shows >> all the time. >> Ken, you’re just screening calls and be like, “Nah, bro.” >> Well, you don’t screen calls. You get the effer and the P guy. Everybody remembers that guy from the news. Anyway, um uh we’re going to wrap it up. Uh you can Can we shill like I know we got in this argument about shilling, but I feel like we should just shill. You should show what you do. We’ll show what Jesse’s doing. I’ll show what I do. >> Yeah, I work at the team. I work at I am a chief evangelist of the Logos project. I’m here to shield the out of it. It’s basically, you know, >> the website tour with TLS, logos.co, logos.co. They’ll learn about >> what it means to build privacy into a a blockchain stack and why it matters and how to get involved. >> We go pull it up there for the people. >> Yeah. >> Mr. Getty works on a distributed storage network from Durability Labs. Forgot that archist I think he called the the actual software. I forget what they’ve called the software now. um run it through a few names, but it’s a it’s a it’s a really good take on how to give strong guarantees of data storage in uh in a way that doesn’t require you to trust Google. >> Uh I’m trying to see if my website’s still up. Do you consult? >> Yeah. So So I’m a consultant. Yeah. I’m a business consultant mostly for the bigger bigger companies, Fortune 500s, but I also have my own business where I consult with small businesses and show you small businesses out there who have the coones to to hold your own crypto, not in something like Coinbase, not in something like uh what’s the other guy? Gemini. >> Gemini. >> That’s one. >> Yeah. Um how to hold your own crypto and also the most important part, >> account for that crypto. So, Uncle Sam doesn’t come throw you in the same jail cell as Diddy. Because if you get in that jail cell, you know what’s going to happen. It’s not going to be It’s going to be a lot. Take that. Take that. Lot of >> Vaseline. >> Yeah. Uh >> baby oil. Baby oil. So, it was >> Oh, it was baby oil, dude. It was a lot. It was an embarrassingly large amount. >> Like a like a like a truckload of baby oil. >> Yeah, it So, anyways, uh this is the Bitcoin podcast. Uh we get give some shout outs now. We’ve had one shout out going for a decade now and that is uh shout out to old long neck wide smile Zoe Sana. >> She has movie coming out. >> Oh, she does and I will be the first in line. I won’t but I’m gonna I’m gonna like it. Uh shout out to Birdman. Um why do we have that? We used to do that with uh we had a joke running about something happening and whatever. It doesn’t matter. >> Ah, shout out to Lori Harvey, of course. Uh, shout out to Alien Earth. Excellent show. Hulu. Check it out. >> I was impressed. >> You like everything. I don’t trust your judgment. >> Uh, it’s not true. I uh, no, I like a lot of things. I don’t like black licorice. >> You don’t like anis? Who? >> Anis. It’s the flavor. >> You smell like a black marker. >> Oh, that flavor is anis. It’s like black licorice has the flavor of anis. >> Oh, wow. Shout out to uh Ahmad. We miss you, bro. Hope you uh hope you make it back to the show sometime. Uh play the outro.